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Non-Duality and Time
"Look at all things and appearances in the same moment, and you see emptiness.
Listen to all sounds at the same time, and you hear silence.
Touch all beings in one moment, and you sense oneness.
Love all beings at the same time, and you feel one.
THINK for only one moment, and you ARE." Wisdompoint
Time is the engagement of the ONE. Forms provide the terms of engagement. Space is the opening of engagement. Love is the power of engagement. Thinking engages. The universe is the field of engagement. Don't be late to your presencing. It is time right now. You are account-able. Show up!
We can work with time once we understand non-duality.
"Life" is the dualistic figment of imagination of the HINDU Bias of "Illusion".
The ONE engages as time. There is no illusion. "Illusion" is pure escapism, soma. The One is unity in diversity, no illusion. All is one energy in different states of transformation, maintaining a cosmos.
The one who does not 'see emptiness' or 'hear silence', does not understand integration.
THINKING is the key to being and cosmos, because of self-awareness. Not only that, THINKING creates out of light with form, sound, and color.
""Life" is the dualistic figment of imagination of the HINDU Bias of "Illusion"."
Response: Any religion is a figment of the mind manifested by Life to maintain the illusory world as real.
"The ONE engages as time."
Response: And the one is the ego which is illusory.
"There is no illusion. "Illusion" is pure escapism, soma."
Response: Illusion does not mean non-existence. Illusion means everything that exists cannot be validated beyond doubt by the function of THINKING.
"The One is unity in diversity, no illusion."
Response: Real cannot be diverse and still be real. Real means that which does not change and is eternal and everywhere. Real cannot be diverse. Real is ONE and can appear diverse only as a reflection.
"All is one energy in different states of transformation, maintaining a cosmos."
Response: Energy is light and it reflects the cosmos for the illusory individual and projects the reflection to appear real to an illusory individual by the illusory functions of the illusory mind.
"The one who does not 'see emptiness' or 'hear silence', does not understand integration."
Response: Emptiness that can be seen is a thought, total emptiness cannot be seen for the seer too would be emptiness, emptiness cannot see itself. Silence that can be heard is less noise and misunderstood as silence, total silence cannot be heard.
"THINKING is the key to being and cosmos, because of self-awareness."
Response: The child makes noise first, mimicks speech later before thinking happens to the child.
"Not only that, THINKING creates out of light with form, sound, and color."
Response: Cheese is made out of milk and milk comes out of cow miraculously and not because of thinking either by man or the cow. The cow cannot and does not give cheese directly. Similarly, thinking happens miraculously as a transformation of sound emitted by man and all sounds do not appear as thinking either, neither could thinking be created out an electric bulb. Not only that thinking does not maintain sleep. Sleep can never be known for what it is, sleep is only known as what it could be by THINKING.
Thinking is not a "function", it creates.
The milk comes out of the cow for a reason and in a certain, definite way, not "miraculously".
The "miracle" starts where reasoning ends.
Thinking has nothing to do with either, "miracle" or "reasoning".
The TRUE opposite to THINKING is MECHANIZATION, and not the duality of the "miracle of life" versus the "illusion of the ego-mind". Thinking is integral in nature, and it creates.
Mechanization befalls wo/man on all accounts, whether it is non-duality or duality. The only saving grace against mechanization is - authentic integration.
Thinking is the key account-ability to begin with, even in non-duality. For what reason would we want to escape this simple fact?
The ONE is engaging as time. Thinking is the key, understanding helps.
"Thinking is not a "function", it creates."
Response: Creation happens every moment. Thinking is impossible in a moment as there is no time in a moment. Function too is ilusory for function requires time and life is timeless and creation happens in life.
"The milk comes out of the cow for a reason and in a certain, definite way, not "miraculously"."
Response: The reason is in the mind and the mind is illusory, thinking cannot determine the exact moment milk is formed in the cow and the exact moment of its journey through its udders. The formation and journey of milk within the cow is miraculous, as is man's journey through life.
"The "miracle" starts where reasoning ends."
Response: The moment is the miracle for reasoning cannot determine or create the moment.
"Thinking has nothing to do with either, "miracle" or "reasoning"."
Response: Thinking has everything to do with miracle or reasoning for wisdompoint quote "miracle starts where reasoning ends".
"The TRUE opposite to THINKING is MECHANIZATION, and not the duality of the "miracle of life" versus the "illusion of the ego-mind". "
Response: Mechanism requires time and life is timeless. If mechanization is the true opposite of thinking, it implies thinking too happens in time and life is timeless. Miracle of life is not the opposite of illusion of the ego-mind, miracle of life INCLUDES the illusion of the ego-mind.
"Thinking is integral in nature, and it creates."
Response: Thinking is in nature as an auditory illusion of subtle sound that happens miraculously in the timeless 'now' in the head which is an optical illusion of light.
"Mechanization befalls wo/man on all accounts, whether it is non-duality or duality."
Response: Wisdompoint quote "Mechanization befalls wo/man on all accounts" end quote, is PRESENT in non-duality as a flow WITHOUT logic or reason but not as actions, the flow is nevertheless a miraculous OPTICAL ilusion. Wisdompoint quote "Mechanization befalls wo/man on all accounts" end quote is PRESENT in duality as actions WITH logic and reason, but nevertheless a miraculous OPTICAL and AUDITORY illusion.
"The only saving grace against mechanization is - authentic integration."
Response: If mechanization were saved, integration, albeit illusory, would not be possible even for a moment.
"Thinking is the key account-ability to begin with, even in non-duality. For what reason would we want to escape this simple fact?"
Response:The simple fact is, non-duality is a flow and not a sum of events separate from each other, and the flow nevertheless is an optical illusion. So to escape from non-duality is not possible for whoever wants to escape is IN the flow and IS the flow and not separate from the flow.
"The ONE is engaging as time. Thinking is the key, understanding helps."
Response: The dream is limitless in time and thinking. Such is the magnanimity of the force of life or light and sound. Superficial understanding leads to knowledge and deep understanding leads to wisdom. Superficial understanding helps to preserve ILLUSORY bondage and deep understanding reveals REAL freedom.
The previous post makes deep and valid points that betray a THINKER! A thinker knows how to UN-THINK instead of reasoning. Thank you for this example and opening of un-thinking.
"A thinker knows how to UN-THINK instead of reasoning."
Response: Man is not the thinker. If man were the thinker there would be no need to think first and then to un-think what man doesn't like. The idea of "un-thinking" could only arise because man is NOT the thinker. If he were the thinker he would only think what he wanted to think and nothing which were needed to un-think later.
Sometimes there are thoughts happening which man doesn't like. Then they disappear as every thought disappears sooner or later and then the thought happens that "I have un-thought it" and the deception of "un-thinking" is perfectly created by life to maintain the illusory world as real to the ego.
This is a rationalization. A "rationalization" is more mechanized than "reasoning". "Reasoning" is mechanized thinking to begin with.
The essence of wo/man is THINKING. Thinking creates. Un-thinking un-creates. That is exactly the point -
Causation.... The one who creates can also un-create. The one who understands that can work with it. Understanding helps. The ONE engages as time.
What are you creating, Andreas, what are you un-creating? Does it happen all the time exactly the way you have planned it? Are you always happy in your family life? You should always be happy with everybody all the time because you should be able to "un-think" your unhappy thoughts whenever you want; and your plans should work all the time, if it were true what you write!
There is a continuous projection of the Hindu Bias that equates in a simplistic, dualistic, and may I say it (?) - idiotic way, agency with "illusion" and "ego".
Just a little respect may lead to a better understanding of 'integration' versus "illusion".
Predicting and explaining the weather does not affect hurricanes or droughts from happening. Driving your car does not happen on the level of the pistons, spark plugs, and fuel injectors. Maintaining your body does not happen on the level of your heart beat, but it does work on the level of breathing, or directing your body to move out of the sun.
I don't have to be a knife or a fork in order to eat with it. I don't have to control all the workings of nature in order to touch someone or not?
To dualistically set nature or "life" against self-awareness and thinking is a Copperfield trick to CREATE the idea of an ILLUSION.
Nobody needs to "create" or "control" the intricacies and mysteries of the digestive process to take a shit at the right time and in the right place. This has nothing to do with thinking yet, but with making decisions, and moving the body.
Shit happens, of course. Humanity is integrally involved with that. It is called "potty training".
Thinking creates and can un-create because of that. Try it consciously one time. You are trying it all the time here anyway?
There is no escaping the fact that the ONE engages intelligently as time. Thinking is the key.
Four posts ago from here, a thinker wrote under the pen name "Marcus" and gave an actual example of un-thinking....
Here is what he wrote, read it carefully. (I will respond to it, once the line of communication is more clear and direct):
["Thinking is not a "function", it creates."
Response: Creation happens every moment. Thinking is impossible in a moment as there is no time in a moment. Function too is ilusory for function requires time and life is timeless and creation happens in life.
"The milk comes out of the cow for a reason and in a certain, definite way, not "miraculously"."
Response: The reason is in the mind and the mind is illusory, thinking cannot determine the exact moment milk is formed in the cow and the exact moment of its journey through its udders. The formation and journey of milk within the cow is miraculous, as is man's journey through life.
"The "miracle" starts where reasoning ends."
Response: The moment is the miracle for reasoning cannot determine or create the moment.
"Thinking has nothing to do with either, "miracle" or "reasoning"."
Response: Thinking has everything to do with miracle or reasoning for wisdompoint quote "miracle starts where reasoning ends".
"The TRUE opposite to THINKING is MECHANIZATION, and not the duality of the "miracle of life" versus the "illusion of the ego-mind". "
Response: Mechanism requires time and life is timeless. If mechanization is the true opposite of thinking, it implies thinking too happens in time and life is timeless. Miracle of life is not the opposite of illusion of the ego-mind, miracle of life INCLUDES the illusion of the ego-mind.
"Thinking is integral in nature, and it creates."
Response: Thinking is in nature as an auditory illusion of subtle sound that happens miraculously in the timeless 'now' in the head which is an optical illusion of light.
"Mechanization befalls wo/man on all accounts, whether it is non-duality or duality."
Response: Wisdompoint quote "Mechanization befalls wo/man on all accounts" end quote, is PRESENT in non-duality as a flow WITHOUT logic or reason but not as actions, the flow is nevertheless a miraculous OPTICAL ilusion. Wisdompoint quote "Mechanization befalls wo/man on all accounts" end quote is PRESENT in duality as actions WITH logic and reason, but nevertheless a miraculous OPTICAL and AUDITORY illusion.
"The only saving grace against mechanization is - authentic integration."
Response: If mechanization were saved, integration, albeit illusory, would not be possible even for a moment.
"Thinking is the key account-ability to begin with, even in non-duality. For what reason would we want to escape this simple fact?"
Response:The simple fact is, non-duality is a flow and not a sum of events separate from each other, and the flow nevertheless is an optical illusion. So to escape from non-duality is not possible for whoever wants to escape is IN the flow and IS the flow and not separate from the flow.
"The ONE is engaging as time. Thinking is the key, understanding helps."
Response: The dream is limitless in time and thinking. Such is the magnanimity of the force of life or light and sound. Superficial understanding leads to knowledge and deep understanding leads to wisdom. Superficial understanding helps to preserve ILLUSORY bondage and deep understanding reveals REAL freedom.]
Sat-Chit-Ananda
"Just a little respect may lead to a better understanding of 'integration' versus "illusion"."
Response: It was not meant as disrespectful to ask you about your daily life. It was not meant, that anybody could prevent unhappy thoughts from happening, it was meant that if man were the thinker, he wouldn't have unhappy thoughts and he would be happy always with his family.
It was not meant that man should be happy all the time but that this is an opportunity to understand that happiness comes and goes and nobody could do anything about it. Like shit happens, thoughts, words, deeds happen too.
Again: What do you create, what do you uncreate? Please talk a little about your daily life and explain it to me what you mean. This is not disrespectful. If you work as a coach the client needs to know what effect your "method" has in YOUR daily life before he tries it himself.
The understanding that man is not the doer, speaker or thinker leads to freedom of happiness and unhappiness. This doesn't mean that happiness and unhappiness don't appear any more, but the search for happiness and the fear of unhappiness are seen through as illusory. The "problem" is not happiness or unhappiness, they come and go anyway, but the belief to be able to do something about it. Observe your daily family-life and you will come to understand the mind.
This "understanding" is a happening and not done by an entity called the "un-thinker". How could it be seen that there is no thinker if it is believed that it were a thinker who sees that? The seeing that there is no thinker but just thoughts happens without a thinker and this seeing is not a thought but a timeless understanding. If it were just a thought it would be knowledge and the deception would arise that there could be an un-thinker which un-thinks thoughts. This is superficial intellectual understanding and just leads to more illusory confusion of the mind. Deep, timeless understanding is real clarity.
As long as we think that "thoughts happen" we can not be account-able for what we are creating. We are cosmic loafers then. Escapist Artists in the name of being. Happiness Hudinis in the name of "illusion".
Being, Thinking, and Seeing are ONE.
"Bondage is of the mind; freedom too is of the mind."
Sri Ramakrishna
The differention between "understanding" as non-agency, and "thinking" as agency is not exclusive but integral.
Andreas: "As long as we think that "thoughts happen" we can not be account-able for what we are creating."
Response: "We" is a thought, "thoughts happen" is a thought, "we can not be account-able" is a thought, "we are creating" is a thought. The "thinker" is a thought too. If it happens that the apparent subject (thinker) of the object (thought) is also seen as an object (just a thought), understanding dawns on you. Otherwise the ego appears still real and illusory confusion will go on instead of real clarity revealing itself.
Andreas: "We are cosmic loafers then. Escapist Artists in the name of being. Happiness Hudinis in the name of "illusion"."
Response: "We", "cosmic loafers", "escapist artists", "being", "illusion" are thoughts too, just sound. Nothing of substance.
Andreas: "Being, Thinking, and Seeing are ONE."
Response: They are ONE as Light which appears as sound too. Pure light is beyond being and non-being, reflected light reflects being and non-being and thinking as well as seeing in form of sound too. Therefore it is all ONE. There is no-one who conducts light and sound. The "one" in Andreas' sentence is the ego and is an illusory manifestation of sound and nothing of substance.
Andreas: ""Bondage is of the mind; freedom too is of the mind."
Sri Ramakrishna"
Response: The THOUGHT of bondage and the THOUGHT of freedom is of the mind. True freedom is the freedom OF the thought of bondage and OF the thought of freedom! This is real understanding. However there is no freedom FROM thoughts, they remain present as sound as long as consciousness is present in the waking/dream-state. Sri Ramakrishna's words have to be understood timelessly and not interpreted in a time-bound manner by the ego.
Andreas: "The differention between "understanding" as non-agency, and "thinking" as agency is not exclusive but integral."
Understanding does not mean that there are no illusory actions. The singular movement of life is beginless and endless and yet beyond time because it projects the illusion of time in the first place. This is the illusory integration which has to be understood. Man is not the thinker, speaker and doer, but nevertheless illusory thoughts, speech and deeds happen.
Did you ponder about your daily life, Andreas? Did you notice the many contradictions in your apparent relationships and the apparent inauthenticity of your teachings in your business? "Inauthenticity" means: The ego claims to be the doer and to be able to teach methods for handling life whereas it does not even see that it is not possible to control life through the mind.
Marcus:"Understand that illusory thoughts, speech and deeds happen!"
Wisdompoint: Unfortunately this is not thinking, but just reasoning and rationalization, in short trickery of the mind.
Here is the cure:
Think real thoughts, say what you think, and act accordingly.
Again, the lack of respect, understanding, and thinking for Integration is obvious, and this time it is projected as supposed "contradictions" about the personal life of "Andreas". All of this is misguided thinking and creation and the person writing it is account-able for that.
Let me repeat the actual issue again, one LAST time:
The one engages as time.
Self awareness means account-ability AND the possibility of the ego.
The one is indeed the ego as it is everything else in time. What are we thinking? How do we understand that? What are we doing with it in self-awareness? How are we account-able?
The Hindu Bias obviously has nothing to say about that but "shit happens". There were some Hindu leaders that transcended this bias. One of them was Ramakrishna (and Vivekananda), an other Sri Aurobindo.
If you just want to be liberated from your neurosis of unnecessary suffering, you are welcome to the Hindu bias of "Illusion" = "agency". If you are contemplating something more, the engagement of the ONE in time, be my guest.However, that implies RESPECT for thinking in the first place.
How does the one engage as time? Unity in Diversity. There is no illusion, but a lot of work to be done.
Sat-Chit-Ananda
Do whatever you want! “Doership is an illusion“ does not mean that you should not do anything. It does not mean that you should not try to achive any goals. Who says you should stop doing, helping others or working for your livelihood?
Life makes you decide what you want to do. Notice that life makes you want it. Notice that life makes you do it or not. If it is meant to happen, it will happen whether you like it or not.
Goals are reached or not and if they are reached it does not take much time until the next goal is in sight. So why not set the goal so high that it is impossible, so that it could never be reached? This would be more realistic than a goal which could be reached, for the final destination in life could never be determined because life is without beginning and without an end. Therefore it is absolutely realistic to set oneself goals which could never be reached!
This will make you aware that goals are meaningless anyway because they are just relative and never real or absolute. Only certain apparent actions are defined by Life manifesting sound appearing as thoughts to signify a goal and these “special“ sounds are the hallmark for man‘s happiness? Why be dependent on some thoughts?
Understand this and you begin to enjoy your apparent doing all the time instead of being concerned about reaching a goal. The worries about not reaching the goal will naturally fade away and stress will subside.
And if you want to make the world a better place, if you want peace on earth, nobody could stop you trying to achive this goal if it happens to you. What‘s wrong with trying to help others?
But if you want to achieve peace you will come to understand that you could only make peace in the world and for others if you yourself are peaceful within yourself. And this will make you aware of the war which is going on in your mind: comparing, judging, blaming, guilt, instisting, demanding, expecting...
If you really want to help the world, illuosory it may be, you need to understand your mind and how ILLUSORY violence is going on inside your own mind. Only if it happens that you become aware of the violence in your own mind, you could offer REAL peace to others, and it will happen naturally without you doing it as everything just happens in this illusory world.
And if you believe to be the doer, it would be the most logical thing to “do“ that you begin to observe your own mind to come to know how it functions so that you are free of it. Then “you“ are available for responding to Life as it really is instead of just reacting to the life of thoughts based on interpretations and beliefs which your mind takes to be real whereas it is utterly illusory.
See emptiness.
Hear silence.
Touch nothing.
Taste purity.
Smell Brahman.
Integration is not the "goal", but what "happens".
Understanding is just a follow up...
Andreas: "See emptiness.
Hear silence.
Touch nothing.
Taste purity.
Smell Brahman.
Integration is not the "goal", but what "happens".
Understanding is just a follow up..."
Response:
Emptiness is, appearing as fullness.
Silence is, appearing as sound.
Nothing is, apearing as something.
Purity is, appearing as pure and impure.
Brahman is, appearing as the world.
No action, no doer.
No word, no speaker.
No thought, no thinker.
Just Light appearing as sound too.
Just sound appearing as action, word and thought
to the mind.
What could be “integration“
where there is no real but just illusory separation?
“Integration“ is just an illusory thought too.
This - the timeless understanding.
.
Andreas: SAT_CHIT_ANANDA
Response: So what?
Andreas: "The last word in this thread...., hopefully!"
Response: Mind wants to have the last word. Mind wants to be right in the end. Life is timeless, no beginning, no end. In Life there is not "last word" for there was never a "first word", words are sound in Life and words to the mind.
And "hopefully" indicates the longing of man that the thinking-process may come to an end. The end of the thinking-process as real thoughts is the understanding that thoughts are just illusory. Then the thinking-process comes to an end and thoughts are seen as sound and not as real words with meanings any more. This - Sat Chit Ananda.
Mind wants to have the last word, and not Marcus and his alter ego, and all together AAU...? The Academy of ABSOLUTE understanding...
Thinking is not a "process", or a "thought", or "mind". It creates out of light with sound, form, and color.
The nexus of this creativity is the "I". What better way to convey how the ONE engages as time and relativity. Self-awareness.
I agree exactly - "so what"? Just a different intonation...the intonation of account-ability, intelligent purpose, and causation.
Sat-Chit-Ananda
Andreas: "Mind wants to have the last word, and not Marcus and his alter ego, and all together AAU...? The Academy of ABSOLUTE understanding..."
Response: The Notion of “last word“ is in the mind, not in life! So who could possibly have it, if not the mind?
Life manifests as AAU to respond to beliefs of the mind to explain their illusoriness. So what could beliefs in creativity of the "I" be?
AAU just explains the function of the mind so that an understanding may happen if it happens. So what could time be?
AAU does not argue with mind for mind is sound and not an actuality in life. So what could
account-ability, intelligent purpose and causation be other than just thoughts i.e. sound?
There is no difference between light and sound, except for self-awareness and vibratory levels. Therefore sound can not be an illusion. There is no separation, just integration.
"Life" is order and harmony to begin with. The ONE engages as time. Why dispute this?
Andreas: "There is no difference between light and sound,"
Response: There is an illusory difference between light and sound, but light and sound are actually one.
Andreas: "Therefore sound can not be an illusion. There is no separation, just integration."
Response: What could be integrated if there were not separation. Because there is no real separation, real integration is not possible.
Andreas: ""Life" is order and harmony to begin with. The ONE engages as time. Why dispute this?"
Response: Because it is not true!!! The ONE in Andreas' post is the ego without being aware of it. The ego is just an auditary illusion of sound, not the doer, speaker or thinker.
That is exactly the point of engagement. If the ONE would engage in its totality as total awareness, omniscience omnipotence, etc. There would be no time or relativity.
When you play a game, or perform a drama, you are a persona in time. Per-sona (from Latin) means 'through sound'.
Absolute Awareness is not the point of focus while we are involved and engaged in the play. The ONE engages as time relatively for certain, definite reasons, mysterious they may be. But we can all see how it works as sound, color and form.
Thinking creates 'world' in the human drama. Self-awareness is the key for this drama in account-ability.
What role does 'non-duality' play in time? None? That is what I thought. The ONE engages AS time. That consitutes the singular MOVEMENT. This is not an illusion. The individual person in self-awareness is the staging of the ONE as time and relativity.
Integration is the compass, plot, and story line for this engagement.
Andreas: "Thinking creates 'world' in the human drama. Self-awareness is the key for this drama in account-ability."
Response: Again: If "you" could create and un-create whatever you want: Why does Andreas have unhappy thoughts from time to time? Why does Andreas say things which he may regret later? Is Andreas always perfectly doing what he "intended" to do?
Who said that? That is a little far fetched? Let us stick with the human creation: the WORLD, not the universe, not life, not the earth - our world.
We are account-able for that, and you are for your world. The ONE engages as time, whether it is a tragedy or a comedy.
What about "Andreas"? He is just one example of billions....
Andreas: "We are account-able for that (our world), and you are for your world. The ONE engages as time, whether it is a tragedy or a comedy.
What about "Andreas"? He is just one example of billions..."
Response: Give me that one example of billions, please! You say that you are account-able for your world and you create or un-create it. So your world should be the hallmark for your understanding!
Life as AAU cares for "your world", Andreas: A deep understanding of the mind is needed to understand "your world" and to be free of it to respond as life to life as it really is (illusory it may be) and not to react to the world as the mind thinks it is.
You are too much engrossed in the bias of "doership" and "illusion", that is why you can not understand thinking causally as a creation, although you are DOING it constantly, here and elsewhere as engagement with time, all the time, you have no choice on that level of sophistication.
It is about HOW we frame 'non-duality' for the "mind" as an understanding, with documentaries, books, CDs, in trainings, coaching, talks, art, etc. This framing is done by THINKING, for better or for worse.
You (and your alter persona) ARE doing it all the time, and you are accountable for that, mysterious it may be. There is no need to look at the world of Andreas particularly, when you have your own world to work with, and then there is the world of humanity - the collective creation and particular history of all humanity.
You are in the middle of that as embodiment.
The formless needs to be framed in certain ways as the engagement in time. It is a matter of self-awareness, creation-causation, thinking and un-thinking.
It is hypocritical to discard thinking as illusion, while we are constantly doing it. It seems political to equate thinking with mind and doership in this context? Let us first of all accept what we are doing all the time and what we are account-able for in that respect. There is no need to start looping about your thinking with "life is happening". The thinker is happening as life and as account-ability, right here and now.
The ONE engages as time. It is indeed a Singular MOVEMENT. Absolute, Relative and Integration.
Andreas: There is no need to look at the world of Andreas particularly, when you have your own world to work with, and then there is the world of humanity - the collective creation and particular history of all humanity.
Response: On the market of “help for man“ a lot of spiritual teachers, psychologists and life coaches offer their knowledge about HOW a happy life could be attained by working with one's own world.
The honest finding would be that the love and care advocated is not attainable in every moment of man’s life. It is merely behaviour even in the life of advocators. Even if the advocating is to earn money, the instructions are not worth it. They still keep you in the mind and not in life.
Life is the timeless and thoughtless “Now“ and mind is time and thought, an auditory illusion of sound of the “Now“.
What is that supposed to mean?
The ONE works with time and relativity, but not to make money. What nonsense to project that unto Wisdompoint. Obviously you still don't have the slightest understanding beyond the bias you are holding.
"Mind" = "thought" is the cultural Hindu Bias of "illusion". The concept of "illusion" is the last vestige of the mind. It is a hubris when you THINK while you are saying it. All saying requires thinking; and think you must, because thinker you are as a calling of non-duality. No wo/man is exempt from that in their account-ability.
The auditory CAPACITY of sound is no illusion at all, but the ONE engaging as time.
The exact opposite of "advocating" non-duality is un-thinking duality. No one gets paid for that in this world. Un-thinking duality is only half the story though...
Account-ability means understanding how we create our world and what world it is. It is Cosmic Conscience, not free wheeling individualism.
Andreas: The ONE works with time and relativity, but not to make money. What nonsense to project that unto Wisdompoint. (...) No one gets paid for that in this world.
Response: Quote www.wisdom-point.com: "WE PROVIDE INDIVIDUAL COACHING OR GROUP SEMINARS THAT FOCUS ON EXCELLENCE, MASTERY, AND INTEGRITY. (...) Rates are situational." End of quotation.
Andreas: Account-ability means understanding how we create our world and what world it is.
Response: The intentions of spiritual teachers, psychologists and coaches end up decieving them, if they consider what they advocate to be the truth. This is how the illusory world is manifested to appear real.
However, it is not wrong at all to care for others, and to earn a livelihood with helping others too. Understand that this how their livelihood is and they cannot prevent, alter or change it, for the simple reason that man is not the doer.
Oh my God......The bureaucracy (Spitzfindigkeiten) of non-duality!
Fortunately Wisdompoint does not need the stamp of approval from 'Marcus'.
His understanding of Wisdompoint and the proposition of 'Integration' is still zero. It must be the DENIAL of "Absolute Understanding" that understands one's own thoughts as the absolute, instead of actually understanding the absolute?
Understanding the absolute is integrating the relative with the absolute, and the absolute with the relative.
It is time to think, instead of this pretentious and mechanizing mode of 'reasoning':
Andreas:....
Response:....
Andreas:....
Response:...
Never, ever once has AAU been able to ask an open, unconditioned question, a question without pre-conception (Vor-urteil), intention and purpose.
At the same time AAU proposes that thinking or purpose are "illusory", that everything is just happening spontaneously. What a hubris we get when we claim the absolute as reasoning or understanding....
Wisdompoint understands and thinks the absolute as integration on an individual and collective scale of humanity, rather than the hubris of understanding the absolute as the absolute as such in contrast to "illusion".
What reference point do we have for the 'Singular Movement'? From which point of reference do we understand, think, and say 'Singular Movement'? Is it "illusory" (mind and experience) or "real" (no time, no doing)?
Or is it a case of 'The Emperor's New Clothes'?....
Andreas: "Never, ever once has AAU been able to ask an open, unconditioned question, a question without pre-conception (Vor-urteil), intention and purpose."
Response: Never, ever once has Wisdompoint answered personal questions about how his pre-conception (Vor-urteil) that man were the doer could be validated in his own life:
post #9: a“What are you creating, Andreas, what are you un-creating? Does it happen all the time exactly the way you have planned it? Are you always happy in your family life?“
post # 25: Marcus: “Again: If "you" could create and un-create whatever you want: Why does Andreas have unhappy thoughts from time to time? Why does Andreas say things which he may regret later? Is Andreas always perfectly doing what he "intended" to do?“
post #27: “Andreas: "We are account-able for that (our world), and you are for your world. The ONE engages as time, whether it is a tragedy or a comedy.
What about "Andreas"? He is just one example of billions..."
Response: Give me that one example of billions, please! You say that you are account-able for your world and you create or un-create it. So your world should be the hallmark for your understanding!“
Andreas: "Understanding the absolute is integrating the relative with the absolute, and the absolute with the relative."
Response: Only the relative could be understood as relative, not the real. Understanding the relative as relative, i.e. illusory, is absolute understanding (however not "understanding the absolute!). So it is Wisdompoint who claims to be able to understand the "absolute" and not AAU!
AAU is all about escapism then?
Why should Wisdompoint answer any personal questions as long as AAU ASSUMES the Absolute and just tries to play relativity with this arrogance?
When Dr.Shankar is ready for that, Andreas will be too...
Andreas: "Why should Wisdompoint answer any personal questions as long as AAU ASSUMES the Absolute and just tries to play relativity with this arrogance?"
Response: Man believes to be the doer, speaker and thinker. Honesty about one's own daily life would reveal that this is not the truth.
"Personal questions" asked by Life as AAU appear personal to the ego whereas they are not personal at all, for the mind is not one's own mind but just sound projected by life.
I, personally, so to speak, have never come across a question which Dr. Shankar ever denied to answer to me, illusory though it is. So you may ask him, Andreas - I am sure, he will respond to you. What is your question? Will forward it to him.
Your "man" is a "fuck up"? The "man" of Wisdompoint is completely account-able as a causation...
Who compromises wo-man more? The one telling her that s/he is an "illusion" and life is just happening, or the one who holds him account-able for her world and creation?
There is no need for me to ask any personal questions of the illusory rupa called "Dr. Shankar", just like there is no need to focus on my persona as a matter of infamy.
All of this is just trickery of the mind. It is IN-DEED (in DOING) about 'Absolute Understanding'...You are rocking the wrong boat my friend. The record speaks for itself, mysterious it may be.
Wisdom has made the point. Ask me any question about AAU, and I will explain it to you in terms of integration.
Andreas: "Your "man" is a "fuck up"? The "man" of Wisdompoint is completely account-able as a causation...
Who compromises wo-man more? The one telling her that s/he is an "illusion" and life is just happening, or the one who holds him account-able for her world and creation?"
Response: The one telling her that s/he is an "illusion" and life is just happening gives man the opportunity to realize freedom of thoughts. The one who holds him account-able for her world and creation compromises wo-man by holding him/her in illusory bondage of responsibility! But neither is the speaker, so neither is accountable for what he advocates to be true.
Andreas: "There is no need for me to ask any personal questions of the illusory rupa called "Dr. Shankar", just like there is no need to focus on my persona as a matter of infamy."
Response: The ego has to hide itself for it believes to be responsible. In fact there is nothing to hide and nothing to disclose for man is not the doer.
Andreas: "Wisdom has made the point. Ask me any question about AAU, and I will explain it to you in terms of integration."
Response: Wisdom interpreted by the ego is knowledge not wisdom. If Wisdom-point believes in "integration" as an act done by man, the ego deceives itself.
No questions?
....?
To see emptiness...
To sense nothing....
To hear silence...
What a pleasure!
To THINK, what a happiness of causation...
Let us get started!
Andreas: To THINK, what a happiness of causation... Let us get started!
Response: Wisdom point should be able to Think to get everyone started, where is the need to request to get started?
This line of REASONING is based on the denial of self-awareness as a principle. This denial stems from the Hindu Bias of "illusion", and it can not understand anything but its own enclosure of ASSUMING the absolute.
We are free to think! The Hindu Bias of "illusion" does not acknowledge this freedom, and therefore wisdompoint asks the readers to get started in this freedom and account-ability of self-awareness and mastery.
The ONE engages as time.
Light, intelligence, and form are an expression of that, so is color and sound, there is no difference, but in vibratory rate - Thinking is the key to creating out of light. We ARE account-able.
Andreas: We are free to think! The Hindu Bias of "illusion" does not acknowledge this freedom, and therefore wisdompoint asks the readers to get started in this freedom and account-ability of self-awareness and mastery.
Response: To whoever the thinking happens that he is accountable, no force on earth can remove that thinking, except the force that makes thinking happen. That force of life is light or intelligence and thinking does not make the force of life or light. Light manifests as the world, man and mind, albeit illusory.
Marcus:"To whoever the thinking happens that he is accountable, no force on earth can remove that thinking, except the force that makes thinking happen. That force of life is light or intelligence and thinking does not make the force of life or light. Light manifests as the world, man and mind, albeit illusory."
Answer: FINALLY we have something to work with: FORCE! Does that mean that life does NOT just happen spontaneously, but is an intelligent FORCE with purposes and therefore can be understood?
That is what Wisdompoint has been saying since the very FIRST engagement with AAU.
Thinking creates out of light as an enhancement of Intelligence. Wo/man is account-able for that, not light, and not intelligence. Integration and Mastery are the determinants of this FORCE as far as humanity is concerned. Think VIRTUE.
Andreas: FINALLY we have something to work with: FORCE! Does that mean that life does NOT just happen spontaneously, but is an intelligent FORCE with purposes and therefore can be understood?
Response: The ego believes to be able to "use" the force of life, whereas the force of life makes the ego happen so that it may appear as the doer. The force of life could not be understood by the mind.
Andreas: Thinking creates out of light as an enhancement of Intelligence. Wo/man is account-able for that, not light, and not intelligence. Integration and Mastery are the determinants of this FORCE as far as humanity is concerned. Think VIRTUE.
Response: To whoever the thinking happens that he is accountable, no force on earth can remove that thinking, except the force that makes thinking happen. That force of life is light or intelligence and thinking does not make the force of life or light. Light manifests as the world, man and mind, albeit illusory.
"Marcus": "To whoever the thinking happens that he is accountable, no force on earth can remove that thinking, except the force that makes thinking happen. That force of life is light or intelligence and thinking does not make the force of life or light. Light manifests as the world, man and mind, albeit illusory."
Response: Never once Wisdompoint says or thinks, that "thinking makes the force of life or light, or intelligence". That would be a silly assertion and a big misunderstanding.
Integration means, in self-awareness, that thinking creates OUT of light. Thinking does NOT create light.
"World" does not mean life, that is "earth", "cosmos", "universe". "World" is human creation as shown on CNN and in our daily lives. How we surround ourselves with our own "world". "World" is particular to humanity in self-awareness.
It needs integration. The ONE engages as time.
Andreas: Never once Wisdompoint says or thinks, that "thinking makes the force of life or light, or intelligence". That would be a silly assertion and a big misunderstanding.
Response: "Never once Wisdompoint says or thinks" - full stop is needed here!
Andreas: Integration means, in self-awareness, that thinking creates OUT of light. Thinking does NOT create light. (...) It needs integration. The ONE engages as time.
Response: Separation is illusory as is integration. Creation is illusory as is time. Man is not self-aware, but awareness expresses itself as man.
Separation and illusion are the dogma of Absolute Understanding.
Integration has nothing to do with separation in the wisdompoint. There is no separation in integration, but there is separation in "illusion".
Andreas: Integration has nothing to do with separation in the wisdompoint. There is no separation in integration, but there is separation in "illusion".
Response: There is illusory separation in illusion. Integration therefore has to be illusory too.
"Look at all things and appearances in the same moment, and you see emptiness."
Response: Absolute Emptiness cannot be seen. Relative emptiness could be seen.
"Listen to all sounds at the same time, and you hear silence."
Response: Silence cannot be heard.
"Touch all beings in one moment, and you sense oneness."
Response: All beings cannot be touched in one moment.
"Love all beings at the same time, and you feel one."
Response: Love is not an act the ego could do.
"THINK for only one moment, and you ARE."
Response: In any moment thinking is absent.
"Time is the engagement of the ONE."
Response: The one is the ego.
"Forms provide the terms of engagement."
Response: Terms are relative and related to the ego.
"Space is the opening of engagement."
Response: Space is a thought.
"Love is the power of engagement."
Response: Love is power and powerless engagement and disengagement.
"Thinking engages."
Response: Thinking engages the ego in illusory bondage. Man made sounds first and later thinking happened to man.
"The universe is the field of engagement."
Response: The universe is a field of energy.
"Don't be late to your presencing."
Response: The ego cannot be late or early for late and early is an illusory concept.
"It is time right now."
Response: 'Now' is timeless.
"You are account-able. Show up!"
Response: Everybody is shown up in life as an optical illusion.
"We can work with time once we understand non-duality."
Response: Mind is time and thought. Life is timeless and thoughtless.
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Marcus Stegmaier